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Post by seayshore on Nov 21, 2007 18:15:26 GMT -8
Boy, do I ever hear you on that one sadnesseen, about taking care of the "me" first. I was well trained in my covert incest to take care of mom first. I was her mother, I was her friend, I was her stand in when she couldn't take it from her husband, which then put me in the position of surregate spouse. I was the baby sitter, I was the cook. I still see them but only when I want to. I used to invite them over way back in my twenties, we would drink together and get wasted. That was how we dealt with the dysfunction. My mother got sober in her mid fifties. I stopped drinking in my early thirties. This helped quite a bit. My mother is toxic to me also, not in any apparent way to outsiders. She is very needy emotionally and I truly believe in my heart that she does not love me. It is impossible for her to love me when she is so needy. She is almost planning on her husband (my step father) to die before her, and not ever living alone wanted to know if she could live with me. The emotional apron strings are always there, she didn't like who I married, she is resentful over the fact I have my own friends, she calls all the time and if I don't answser then some thing awful has happened to me..."where were you, what are you doing?" God, I can't even go to the bathroom without being questioned and here I am fifty five years old. It's those boundaries that are the hardest to set, at least with me any way. I want to be a part of the family and I would have liked us all to heal as a family before every one starts to die off...but that is a fantasy and not living life on life's terms. I have talked to my mother, I told her that what ever happens in the future, what ever I decide to do, that it is MY LIFE and not hers. As I see it, she is unable to separate herself from me, not the other way around. Yes, it is a constant struggle to own our own lives, especially if we still are involved. I don't know what kind of hell you'd pay for not showing up at a holiday function, but NO works real good.
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Post by sadnesseen on Dec 25, 2007 23:15:14 GMT -8
Holiday season postscript : Gee, it wasn't so bad after all. Visiting my mother on Christmas Eve. I guess I learned some kind of forgiveness. Even forgiving the family members I no longer speak to. In some way, i've FINALLY learned forgiveness. Doesn't mean my bitterness, anger or resentment has been resolved. More or less dissolved. Don't allow the space for it. I need that space for better things. Whatever they may be.
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Post by sadnesseen on Dec 25, 2007 23:31:49 GMT -8
Thanks seayshore, I just read your reply a month late! All the things you said are very relatable. But there was one thing I really somehow clicked on : knowing in my heart that my mother never really loved me. Especially since i got married 11 years ago. Its almost as if she felt ''how dare you get married and stop being my surrogate husband'' kind of vibe. Wow. The best thing i've done is remove myself from the sick family i grew up in.
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Post by nickatnite on Dec 26, 2007 12:16:25 GMT -8
You need to read the thread i started this week . it's under the " Information section " "How to reduce your anxiety and depression " bye
I CAN'T STRESS IT ENOUGH !!! BYEE!!!
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Post by babbak on Jan 2, 2008 1:12:19 GMT -8
Holy crap! I just read your first post... my mom slept with me until I was 8 and I had to throw a fit to move into my own room. I feel sick and shamed and am full of dispair about it too. I'm 42 and have managed to NOT think about it, but it has profoundly affected my life, and it just won't go away. (The sleeping with me part is, as with you, just the tip of the iceberg!).
I just wanted to VALIDATE your rage. My mom is 79, and I too, still go home every christmas, etc. I tried to confront her a few years ago, and she did a great job of beating herself up in just the right way to make ME feel EVERY single STAB of her pain. Does that ring any bells? Just curious.
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Post by sadnesseen on Jan 4, 2008 15:30:01 GMT -8
From my experience, my mother never ever owned up to anything. My mother lives in a world of denial. It was always about HER feelings, HER hardships etc.. She pretty much denies any of the emotional abuse etcetc. It's a waste of time to even confront her, because i've confronted her many MANY countless times about it. It's ultimately a waste of time. So I'd have to say yes it rings many bells. Loud and clear. Abusive mothers almost NEVER own up to the severe damage they cause and if and when they do they somehow turn it back right onto YOU all over again. And sometimes they are just too selfish and deluded to even admit it to THEMSELVES. It is best to disconnect and stay as far far away as possible, in my opinion. It can be difficult, but you have to think of YOURSELF first. I'm still learning every day. It helps to have a good sense of humor too [sounds ridiculous but its really true!].
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Post by nickatnite on Jan 6, 2008 23:51:44 GMT -8
how's everything going with you Sadnesseen ? I hope you are understanding and seeing new things now , as days are passing by. It's a good sign . There is nothing to be worried about . Did you buy the books mentioned here ? I hope u r doing good. Good nite.
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Post by sadnesseen on Jan 9, 2008 21:32:31 GMT -8
Hi nickatnite, things are going well for me now thanks. You must have esp, because you are correct, I AM seeing new things now as days are passing by. Learning to let go of things that are useless and unproductive to me. I don't really worry as much either. Not sure why really. This ''processing past trauma'' thing seems to have run its course maybe. All I can say for myself is : IT is ABOUT TIME i FINALLY let this stuff go. Thanks 4 asking, I never did buy any books. Just back to reading old Brautigan books I have already read. And a Fassbinder bio.
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Post by nickatnite on Jan 13, 2008 7:23:51 GMT -8
yeah , the old saying , count your blessings more - doesn't work in our situation(s) purely because of the VIOLENT AND DISGUSTING situation we were in , Not to mention TOXIC !! but after a while I learned to let go of my family and stop believing it could roll back to the beginning of the tape and start the movie with a different story . Just won't happen . Because , WELL....HMM.. I could sit here and type , LIKE NIKE. and Adidas - Impossible is nothing and Just do it , .. and maybe we can fix our parents . if we try OUR MAXIMUM ...but what's the point ? Do you know how much energy it will take from our part to do that ? That energy will BURN US !! trust me , i tried in the beginning , but I crashed and burned ..... best is to let the rest stay there .. and GET THE HELL OUT OF THE PLACE !!. good luck ! to you !
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Post by portlander on Jan 13, 2008 11:55:29 GMT -8
I agree with Nick to a certain extent. Getting someone else to change is like, as the old saying goes, trying to teach a pig to sing - it wastes your time and annoys the pig.
People can and do change. But it rarely, if ever, happens because someone else tells them they need to change, particularly if they're hearing it from the victim. True change has to come from within themselves and can't be forced via confrontation or intervention.
I've been participating in this board for over a year, and I've yet to see a story of anyone succesfully "rolling back the clock".
There IS a place for confrontation and/or intervention though. If the abuser is still behaving inappropriately, an intervention can sometimes get them to stop. And sometimes a confrontation can help with your own peace of mind by getting it off your chest. It won't roll back the clock, though, because there will always be the "elephant in the room" that others have spoken of. I think the best anyone can do is figure out how to deal with the elephant, but it will always be there.
I figure it's like having a scar after a major accident - some people recover, some people learn to adjust and live with it, and some people do better at it than others. But no matter how well you deal with it, the scar will ALWAYS be there.
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Post by sadnesseen on Jan 16, 2008 23:25:56 GMT -8
Wow. nickatnite and portlander posts = insightful words of wisdom. Its ALL true. Distance, emotional and physical, can be an excellent thing. It has been working for me. Now I have to get me working again. Spent countless hours dwelling, swimming and obsessing with the past because i'm not totally satisfied with my place in this world right now in the present. Yes, i've crashed and burned so many times. What a waste. But not now. Not anymore. Not ever. Wishful thinking at best, but I have no other choice at this point. The hardest job in the world is moving forward. Its great becasue I don't feel sense of shame or isolation when I come to this board. I thank everyone for that and the person who made this board is truly a lifesaver. Once again, wow!!!
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Post by persephone5 on Mar 17, 2008 22:23:06 GMT -8
Hi. i'm new to the site. was reading and must say it's refreshing to hear people think what i am thinking, too. i've been in recovery solid for about 8 years now, but was in and out of therapy since about 19. i'm 36 now.
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Post by persephone5 on Mar 17, 2008 23:08:40 GMT -8
me gain, technical error. anyway, iagree and i think it's something that is always a part of me. no matter how much i move forward i feel a sadness for the total tragedy of it all. my birth mother has 13 documented personalities and my father grew up in a concentration camp (he's very narcisissict and probably a few other things). talk about guilt. can you imagine complaining about anything to these people? especially then. it was madness. still is but i'm coping with it much better these days. mom and i are enmeshed and i was dad's firstborn. although i don't remember sex with him, he definitely crossed the line and i was his emotional girlfriend although by this time there was a stepmother that is a whole other blog. dad needs to feel special and to be admired. he easily loses interest in anything else from me. we talk once a month or so and live on opposite coasts. he said he did not have sex with me, i asked him to his face. he admitted it was inappropriate to sleep in my bed for the months i was there, but that was it. mom is very close to me. better now than ever, but still too close for me. with her illness, i have parented her from the womb. she is better these days but old habits die hard. we hardly ever lived together, but she had me until i was 2 or 3. i was her sustenance. a seriously mentally ill, undiagnosed 24 year old woman taught me to BE THERE FOR HER. i was managing the unmanageable before i could walk or speak. she threatened and attempted suicide many times and once showed me the correct way to slit my wrists "if i was serious". i think i was about 8 or so. so now i'm angry. but i know i'm angry. i limit my contact with her more than ever, while still maintaining a relationship that is as loving as we know how to be. triangles and other symptoms brought me to recovery. i still get into them. i wish i knew how to just "be better". truth is i AM better. maybe i still have goals, but my progress is amazing. it feels good whenever it happens, sort of addictive after the initial depression or anxiety before a breakthrough. there's a point where now just becomes more interesting. slowly i'm building my fractured psyche into something i can actually get down with! my situation is complex and it's reasonable that it takes time to resolve. when i first realized even just the beginning stuff, it felt like death. i had no tools to cope. now i have better tools, resources and boundaries. still problematic, but better.
anyone reading i hope you get something from this. i got a lot from hearing others thoughts.
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Post by sadnesseen on Mar 25, 2008 19:50:13 GMT -8
i sure wished i lived on an opposite coast.i still live in the same home town. the creepy claustrophobic feeling i get when i visit my mother makes me ill. i've tried but i don't think i am able to forgive her for using/abusing me. even though it wasn't sexual abuse, it was very bad. i go there less and less and less. still, no matter what, STILL difficult and STILL sickening. it gets better and then i relapse w/ flashbacks and stuff. sad how families are.
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Post by maxtsa on Mar 25, 2008 23:07:16 GMT -8
i sure wished i lived on an opposite coast.i still live in the same home town. the creepy claustrophobic feeling i get when i visit my mother makes me ill. i've tried but i don't think i am able to forgive her for using/abusing me. even though it wasn't sexual abuse, it was very bad. i go there less and less and less. still, no matter what, STILL difficult and STILL sickening. it gets better and then i relapse w/ flashbacks and stuff. sad how families are. i have that too, when i come back to the neighborhood where i grew up i feel terrible. just like i did as a kid.
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